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Game server information & questions.

Moderators: Joe Kari, Pardner, TheDoctor

Anti-wallhack feature for SG

Postby TheDoctor » Thu Oct 28, 2010 8:14 pm

Dear SG Players,

we are currently testing an anti-wallhack feature on Baller Bude. The basic idea is to prevent the server from sending coordinates of players hidden behind walls. From the perspective of a client, this corresponds to a temporal removal of players from the map as soon as there is not a direct line of sight. A client cannot circumvent this preventive measure as it is implemented server-side. In case you are playing on BB, give us some feedback on whether you like this new feature :) .

Image
  1. The first picture is a view at the saloon of br_santacruz. The viewer sees one guy with a knife and maybe he thinks of pulling out his knife as well.
  2. The same view, now featuring an exemplary wallhack. Apparently, this is a trap.
  3. Thanks to the anti-wallhack, the cheater's client would be unaware of the concealed players as the server never send the coordinates of the hidden players.
To see this feature in effect, watch a demo like this one with \r_shownormals 1. You will see the players appearing in the moment they become visible (as opposed to being constantly visible).
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Postby /dev/random » Thu Oct 28, 2010 9:37 pm

I guess you could still get quite accurate player positions with events such as footsteps, falling damage and some extrapolation. Maybe you could also abuse the clientside delay features of unlagged.
I also like how your image somewhat implies that fair players use the old v1.0 client :D

Edit: Seems like the feature needs more finetuning
Image Image
Apart from that, pings seem to be higher than before.
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Postby ^SDE^Evans » Thu Oct 28, 2010 10:59 pm

cool :D

will now decrease the number of cheaters? : D
I hurt myself today (8)
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Postby TheDoctor » Fri Oct 29, 2010 12:48 am

/dev/random wrote:Seems like the feature needs more finetuning.
Thanks for the report. Indeed, I forgot to reset certain timers which rendered the previous version ineffective after one round. The server has been updated and restarted.

/dev/random wrote:Image
Spectators see every player anyway (to save CPU usage).

Apart from that, pings seem to be higher than before.
Yes, but unfortunately, this has nothing to do with the patch. It seems the quality of BB's network link has recently degraded and/or it's shared usage has changed.
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Postby moRtem » Fri Oct 29, 2010 9:06 am

thumbs up, doctor!

I couldn't test myself yet, but a few questions:

- Is it still possible to hear footsteps/reloading/... of players who ain't in your field of view?

- Are players still seen behind transparent materials? (windows etc.)

- Are players still seen behind more complex objects like fences / racks / ... ?

- Does it work fine with players who are on different heights (e.g. a player is standing on a roof [of low height] - another player is standing on the ground in front of the house. Now it might occur that the player on roof moves forward, actually could see the player's head on ground already, but the anti-wallhack-tool prevents information to be send until the player on roof got a clear line of sight from his center of the body to the opponent's center of the body)

- Does it work with players who are standing behind walls/boxes/signs where only the head is still visible ?



(a tool like this is implemented in more games already, like in a q2-mod of r1ch, or Noghost [Q3])


thanks.


/quit
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Postby TheDoctor » Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:42 am

moRtem wrote:Is it still possible to hear footsteps/reloading/... of players who ain't in your field of view?
Most player-specific sounds are currently transmitted via the player entity. Those can no longer be heard through walls (it does not depend on your field of view, but on direct sight between player coordinates). Other sounds (e.g. bullet impact) are transmitted via separate entities and remain audible.

moRtem wrote:Are players still seen behind transparent materials? (windows etc.)
Yes. Only solid (= bullet-proof) but transparent brushes would hide players. Luckily, these are very rarely used.

moRtem wrote:Are players still seen behind more complex objects like fences / racks / ...
Yes.

moRtem wrote:Does it work fine with players who are on different heights?
Yes.

moRtem wrote:Does it work with players who are standing behind walls/boxes/signs where only the head is still visible?
Yes.
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Postby Mart Duggan » Sat Nov 06, 2010 1:18 am

I don't know if it is related, but around the time this feature was installed I began to notice a problem when I play BB. Upon entering a room or scene, I quickly notice no one and begin to turn or move. Then, a fraction of a second later, someone pops into the picture and starts shooting at me after I have begun turning away. This puts at an immediate disadvantage.

Perhaps my relatively high ping plays a part. Perhaps I never notice that before. I don't know, but if it continues I may play there much less, which means far fewer easy kills for you sharpshooters. :D
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Postby TheDoctor » Sat Nov 06, 2010 3:04 am

Mart Duggan wrote:I don't know if it is related ... Perhaps my relatively high ping plays a part.
Yes, your high ping is definitely a part of this problem. It takes at least a ping's worth for players to become visible (when a player becomes visible to your client according to the server state, this information still has to travel from the server to your client).

What is your most known in-game name? What is your average and maximum ping? For a ping > 100, try to set \cl_timenudge -50 in the console. Does it reduce the described problem? I can check whether it is feasible to add a ping compensation to the prediction, similar to the unlagged feature of aiming.
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Postby Mart Duggan » Sun Nov 07, 2010 5:25 am

Thanks for the quick response!

What is a console? Game controls? I am not totally computer hip. :(

My ping averages nearly 200 in BB. Very high I know! But I like the maps and the competition, even thought I usually get my somewhat aged rear end whipped.

I am usually known as the dreaded Hoss. Or maybe ohboyherecomesaneasykill Hoss! Ha!

It seems some maps have less ping than others. Perhaps sound plays a part? The Fort, Dry Gulch seem to play well. San Cuccio Coyote Bluff are 2 that seem to have lots of lag.

Appreciate your efforts, regardless I will most likely continue to wander into BB. Thoughts of avoiding it usually follow playing BB for a while, taking a drink and watching the water shoot out of all the holes in my dessicated body. Ouch! :D
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Postby moRtem » Sun Nov 07, 2010 10:35 am

TheDoctor wrote:
moRtem wrote:Is it still possible to hear footsteps/reloading/... of players who ain't in your field of view?
Most player-specific sounds are currently transmitted via the player entity. Those can no longer be heard through walls (it does not depend on your field of view, but on direct sight between player coordinates). Other sounds (e.g. bullet impact) are transmitted via separate entities and remain audible.


I had a game on Ballerbude now and have to say that this is really disturbing (not hearing footsteps of players running around a corner.

I really think it's awesome to have an anti-wallhack feature, but this part definately needs to be tuned/fixed before being implemented on non-testservers.

--

Other than that, it works out pretty well, altough i face the same problem as Mart (players suddenly appearing in your fov altough a room had been empty just a moment before) -- my ping isn't that bad though -> 60.

What is a console?


ingame, press ~ or ^ to open it (before you enter a command, do backspace twice).


/quit
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Postby Biondo » Sun Nov 07, 2010 11:03 am

moRtem wrote:I had a game on Ballerbude now and have to say that this is really disturbing (not hearing footsteps of players running around a corner)


Strange, I had the opposite feeling. I always considered a bug the way sounds propagate in SG: you can hear through walls as if they weren't there, when inside a tunnel you can hear players walking in open air as if they were in tunnel too ...

Of course, if you are used to hear sounds that you are not supposed to hear you can feel a lack of something. I suppose, in a similar way, a wallhacker should feel the lack of something ;)

I feel sound environment is more realistic in BallerBude now.
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Postby moRtem » Sun Nov 07, 2010 11:16 am

Biondo wrote:Strange, I had the opposite feeling. I always considered a bug the way sounds propagate in SG: you can hear through walls as if they weren't there, when inside a tunnel you can hear players walking in open air as if they were in tunnel too ...


I've to admit that this 'effect' is weird too.

But on Ballerbude you can't even hear players who are running next to you, just because there's a an obstacle in between. And in my opinion this totally spoils the game, since opponents seem to 'warp' into your field of view.



/quit
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Postby TheDoctor » Wed Nov 10, 2010 12:28 pm

I just fixed/circumvented a bug related to bots and doors. For instance, on dm_train, for some reason, bots did get invisible when they were touching doors. UPDATE: This bug was caused by unintentionally disabling Tequila's temporary fix of the invisibility bug.

To all those who have problems with the anti-wallhack feature: please try to record a client-side demo (in console: \record and \stoprecord). Write down the filename (usually demo0000.dm68) and look for it either in
  • %APPDATA%\Smokin' Guns\smokinguns\demo\ (use "Run" and copy it in) or
  • C:\Program Files\Smokin' Guns\smokinguns\demo\ (installation directory)
Under Windows XP the former expands to \Documents and settings\username\Application data\Smokin' Guns\smokinguns\demo\ , under Windows Vista or Windows 7, the former expands to \Users\username\Appdata\Roaming\Smokin' Guns\smokinguns\demo\
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Postby Leo Campos » Wed Dec 08, 2010 11:01 pm

who has the IP for the Buller Bude?
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Postby Biondo » Wed Dec 08, 2010 11:07 pm

BallerBude:
212.65.13.87:27960

SpecialBude:
212.65.13.87:27961

Players statistics:
@spi's Baller Bude
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