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More Music?

Postby Wh1sper » Sun Jan 04, 2009 7:30 pm

It should be possible to put some more music in the queue.
I'found an Album under http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/
So it should be possible to legally include some instrumenals from this: http://www.jamendo.com/de/album/32667
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Postby Breli » Sun Jan 04, 2009 9:20 pm

Thats a cool idea, but I'd rather not have that stuff in SG :lol: ... too "electrical" for my liking.

Does anybody know, however, the status of all the "classic" western movie songs? AFAIK the copyright expires after 25-30 years or so. At least thats the case in Germany if I am not mistaken. I would love to add a few of these to newer maps if thats legally possible.

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Postby DeUgli » Sun Jan 04, 2009 10:16 pm

Breli wrote:Does anybody know, however, the status of all the "classic" western movie songs? AFAIK the copyright expires after 25-30 years or so. At least thats the case in Germany if I am not mistaken. Breli


It is a complex subject. I can't speak to the situation in Germany, but you can read about US copyrights at The US Copyright Office website. Scroll down the page a bit.
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Postby Wh1sper » Sun Jan 04, 2009 11:26 pm

I am pretty sure, that it is impossible to use old soundtracks from famous movies. And yes, my example is not absolutly insane, but hear all of them 2 or 3 are quite useful.
And please hunt for such music in the net. I'm sure there some stuff.
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Postby zeVlad » Sun Jan 04, 2009 11:40 pm

If I can give help, as European lawyer I can say the situation about EU copyright law.
The rules are simple :
- the author and his heirs have a copyright on his works until 70 years after the author's dead.
- the producer, editor or interpreter get a similar right on the work they produce, publish... until 50 years after the making of the work.

So maybe somes producers, interpreters lost their rights (musics performed until 1958) on the EU territory, but we have to find a composer dead in 1938 or before to get really public domain music (on the EU jurisdiction).

Sadly, I don't think that we can find this composer for the western music... :cry:

As far as I know, the US legislation about copyright is yet worst, see the link of Breli.

PS : this 01/01/2009, Popeye became part of public domain in EU ! :D
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Postby EvilFutsin » Sun Jan 04, 2009 11:49 pm

Wouldn't that mean we can get music from silent westerns or old 30s John Ford movies?
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Postby zeVlad » Mon Jan 05, 2009 12:05 am

Ok, so, to explain the thing from another point of view, to have a "free" (public domain) music, you have to find a music :
- performed before 1958 (or by you, if you got the score :wink: )
- composed by a guy who died in 1938 or before.
And with all this, you have a free music ONLY on the EU jurisdiction (US protection is longer).

In US, it's a bit more complicated. But, briefly, there is a protection during 95 years after the "securation" of the copyright (usually, publication or so). So find a music of 1913 for our american friends... :|

EDIT : american friends, whom you belong :D
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Postby DeUgli » Mon Jan 05, 2009 2:26 am

zeVlad wrote:If I can give help, as European lawyer I can say the situation about EU copyright law.
Thank you, zeVlad. It is good to have authoritative legal advice about the EU.

I am not a lawyer, but I am a retired professional musician, and have dealt with the use of recorded music in theatrical settings. Believe me, it is very difficult to stay within legal bounds, even of the US "fair use" law. My view of sampled music use in the context of a game which is distributed internationally is that you will probably be in violation of some copyright law somewhere in the world. Now, you may never be hunted down and prosecuted for it, because it is not worth the time of the copyright owners. However, according to an article I was recently reading, there is heightened interest by law firms in policing all aspects of video games.
The SG dev team took great pains to remove and replace even small bits of recordings from films for this reason.

Another way to look at this is, the more original elements you have in your game, map or whatever, the greater your accomplishment. For instance, if you record your own guitar track and put it in your game, you are showing more creativity than if you stick in off-the-rack music. Maybe you aren't Ennio Morricone, but you don't have to be for these purposes. Maybe you'll even find that you are the next Morricone. :)
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Postby Pyrite » Mon Jan 05, 2009 3:10 am

As some have mentioned, there are sources of legal (e.g. Creative Commons) music about, such as Jamendo or LegalTorrents. If anyone can be bothered, there *might* also be the opportunity of finding bands who are willing to let their music be used in the game for free. A small local band who plays the right kind of stuff might be willing to agree to a song being used in Smokin' Guns, after all, so long as the song is properly credited they get free promotion! I know a couple of guys who work at a small record label (called Sotones), I can try to see if they have any bands who might be willing... of course, legally this would be more complicated than just finding Creative Commons music, it might not be worth the effort.

The other alternative: some people on here must be musicians (DeUgli for one)! I play a few instruments, if people want to get together over the internet and try out some ideas for the game, I wouldn't mind contributing some music, it's for a good cause!
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Postby zeVlad » Mon Jan 05, 2009 1:26 pm

@DeUgli : yes, there's always e big gap beween theorical law and his application. But the majors are angry these years, and there's a big legal uncertainty about this uses (and ther's no "fair use" exception in EU, not even exception for free or non-commercial use, only exception for citation, educative and so). Furthermore, as you said, it's more rewarding to make all original elements, but I can't talk for the team. :wink: And the work made on the SA is already too big.

@Pyrite : yes, CC works or agreement with a small label are good solutions, too. Let's search these kind of stuff !
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Postby Wh1sper » Mon Jan 05, 2009 6:34 pm

Yes, just asking a local band might be a great option.
Look at Worl of padman. Those Guy are having more than 15 Tracks especially invented for the Game. I do not fear that this possible for Smokin' guns, too!
For my little part I'm searching at Jamendo further and maybe I discover a jewel worth to include in the juwel of FPS :-)
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Postby zeVlad » Mon Jan 05, 2009 8:38 pm

There is also Dogmazic about free/CC musics.
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Postby Wh1sper » Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:35 pm

I just discovered Paco Santiago - Guitarras en la Alpujarra Volumen I
especially no:7 (1-11 are all quite useable)

Jamendo is updating, cannot find link so search for your own.
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Postby zeVlad » Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:53 pm

Sounds good. I love it ! Thx for the discovery. :)

But, I find it too quiet for violent/action ingame. But I just played with, and it's yet pretty nice. I don't know.

There are some classics nicely re-arranged and interpreted in this album ! :P
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Postby Wh1sper » Thu Jan 08, 2009 7:14 am

I think, some parts out of the tracks are quite usable.
As far as I remember, a map can select a special track.
before an opponent appears there might a good point to play this.
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