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DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:32 am

hi, i left this info with a few people in the IRC but so far it hasn't been addressed

here is the problem

i got the game from desura

servers were not showing up EXCEPT for lannuka.fi, got monsterbrowser
when you'd try to connect to servers it would try to download files at
3 to about 5k/sec - this would take forever

that is some kind of bug because of the files being inside desura/common etc. but not sure, this was done on two systems on two different net connections confirmed!

have no idea how you can fix that but dl through desura and modify monster to point to desura folder to run the game and you will see it

2nd, could only connect to lannuka.fi inside Desura because it would show as a server and its using the old file structure. from poking around looks like most of the old files are now in a 373mb file sgpak0.pk3 which in the old distribution (the one on Desura) it's about 73mb and many other supporting files that aren't in the new distribution that is posted on smoking-guns.org/downloads

so a few things are happening, desura should grow the game but it hobbles newbies who can't get past the problems -- if they manage to find the info on monsterbrowser and manage to direct it to the correct desura folder it will not download at a rate that is acceptable so they can't even get the new files from the new distribution that they normally would be updated too -- WHY this is so slow I do not know but as i said i suspect its something with how the folder structure is but one of the programmers here can figure it out surely

those who get the old distro on desura are pretty much stuck to lannuka.fi
many won't be able to modify monsterbrowser to point to the correct folder for the desura install and even if they do the dl's will be too slow

so i think the new distro must be put on Desura ASAP

i have informed the admin of lannuka.fi that he's using the old files/distro etc

if he updates and you have Desura auto update to the correct new files distro
everyone should be good and lots of new players you're not seeing will show up

this took a lot of sleuthing to figure out - hope it contributes to the game
great game, keep up the good work.

PS: someone who is in charge please let me know this got through, thanks!
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Wed Jun 19, 2013 11:34 am

NOTE: even if the desura distro is updated someone will have to figure out if the slow download problem still exists
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby TheDoctor » Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:20 pm

I've PM'ed Pardner, who AFAIK was last in charge of publishing SG to Desura. Don't know whether he has time for an update though.
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby Pardner » Wed Jun 19, 2013 3:39 pm

I guess I am in charge of publishing SG on Desura since sparcdr left. I have not even looked into using Desura :(

It looks like the Windows version was updated to SG1.1, but the Linux version was never updated.
Branch Releases (view old) Release Date Filesize Version
Full Linux 1 year ago 343mb (359,392,620 bytes) 1.0
Full Windows 2 years ago 385mb (403,748,552 bytes) 1.1


If you are using Monster Browser you must be using windows... therefore you should have SG1.1.... therefore you should be able to see the servers running SG1.1. So I am a little confused. I will try to install Desura and test the Windows release this weekend (providing I can find the time).

I am not sure what was uploaded for the linux release. Was it just the SG1.0 OS Independant package? If so I can update that right now.

panzino wrote:have no idea how you can fix that but dl through desura and modify monster to point to desura folder to run the game and you will see it

As far as getting Monster to point to the Desura directory, you need to edit your mods.ini file in %appdata%/monster browser. If you only have SG installed Desura and do not plan to install SG without Desura, just edit the existing Smokin' Guns mod to point to your Desura path.
[Smokin' Guns]
mod=smokinguns
regKey=HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Smokin' Guns Productions\Smokin' Guns\InstallPath
exeName=smokinguns.exe
exePath=C:\Program Files\Smokin' Guns\smokinguns.exe
masterServer=master.smokin-guns.org
etColors=true

You can also add an additional Smokin' Guns mod and call is something different [SG Desura]... that way if you ever install SG without Desura, you can choose which version to run from Monster Browser.
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Thu Jun 20, 2013 8:56 am

TheDoctor wrote:I've PM'ed Pardner, who AFAIK was last in charge of publishing SG to Desura. Don't know whether he has time for an update though.



Thanks
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Thu Jun 20, 2013 9:10 am

hi Pardner

Note: servers do not show up in the game except for Lannuka.fi because it was using the old distro and still works...nothing else shows - after getting monster browser you can indeed see other servers

Yes the monster browser pointing to Desura can be edited but not by many. That's not the larger issue -- the larger issue is the old file structure that Desura installs verses the new file structure -- ideally this would be a non-issue since any server would point your program to file depository and you'd simply download the new files HOWEVER this does not work correctly because for SOME reason when you are running the game through Desura and it tries to dl the new files it goes EXTREMELY SLOWLY (would take days at that rate to DL the new files).

Putting a modified monster browser with the correct mods.ini file in the Desura distro might be a good idea but you still need the updated supporting file structures to get them working out of box as the DL rate in that Desura Distro is too slow to work - it will just time out its so slow - I left it running 2 days to see - trust me on this

Have no idea why it dl so slowly vs the direct install of SG but it does.

Perhaps just upload an all new set to Desura with a properly configured MonsterBrowser for noobs and let it update as Desura offers an update service.
That's my suggestion.

Otherwise anyone who gets SG through Desura will only see the one Lannuka.fi server in the game directly - won't know about Monster browser more than likely and will be stuck there and think thats the limit of the game -- when Lannuka.fi updates their file structure they likely won't see any servers at all!

I hope this makes it more clear. It's not an easy situation to understand - it took me a long time to work through it and decypher exactly what was going on.

All the best!, regards
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby Pardner » Thu Jun 20, 2013 9:35 pm

I appologize for chopping up your post, I hope I did not take anything out of context. First MonsterBrowser
panzino wrote:Yes the monster browser pointing to Desura can be edited but not by many.

Why can't people edit the mod.ini? Yes, idealy people shouldn't have to modify anything.
panzino wrote:Putting a modified monster browser with the correct mods.ini file in the Desura distro might be a good idea...

panzino wrote:Perhaps just upload an all new set to Desura with a properly configured MonsterBrowser for noobs and let it update as Desura offers an update service.

MonsterBrowser is not package with Smokin' Guns and it is maintained separately. torhu is the one who created MB and its up to him to determin whether is packaged with Desura or not. (I will PM him, maybe if we are lucky he can fix MB to detect the Desura installed SG)

panzino wrote:...ideally this would be a non-issue since any server would point your program to file depository and you'd simply download the new files HOWEVER this does not work correctly because for SOME reason when you are running the game through Desura and it tries to dl the new files it goes EXTREMELY SLOWLY (would take days at that rate to DL the new files).

panzino wrote:Have no idea why it dl so slowly vs the direct install of SG but it does.

SG1.0 does not support html auto downloads. It uses Q3's way of downloading the content on the game connection (sorry network admins, I don't know the terminology and I'm being lazy and look it up). SG1.1 does support HTML downloads thanks to Tequila insegrating the IoQ3 patch. So.... basically... we wouldn't have to worry about this problem is Desora had SG1.1 avaliable for download!

panzino wrote:but you still need the updated supporting file structures to get them working out of box

This is the main problem. I am still confused. It looks like the Windows version was updated to SG1.1, but the Linux version was never updated. I am not sure what was uploaded for the linux release. Was it just the SG1.0 OS Independant package?
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby torhu » Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:35 pm

I'm not a Desura user, so if someone wants to post the needed changes to mods.ini, that would be nice. At least people can find them here then :)

There's no reason the builtin server browser shouldn't work properly though, is everyone using SG through Desura having the same issue?
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby TheDoctor » Thu Jun 20, 2013 10:39 pm

Pardner wrote:SG1.0 does not support html auto downloads. It uses Q3's way of downloading the content on the game connection.
You're right. In SG1.0, the only way to transfer .PK3 files is for the server to append the data as payload to its game packets. As a consequence, this type of download is either slow or possibly disturbs the gameplay as it utilizes the server's connection.

Pardner wrote:I am not sure what was uploaded for the linux release. Was it just the SG1.0 OS Independant package?
I don't know Desura and at the moment, I cannot answer the question. Could we PM sparcdr and ask him, if he could explain to us what needs to be done to package SG1.1 for Desura on Linux?
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Fri Jun 21, 2013 1:44 am

Pardner,

thanks for your reply
i suggest you install desura and install sg under it
then have a look at the slow dl bug i'm referring too
it simply does not work right
sg installed in the normal default folder does dl at normal speeds

you won't damage your sg install and the desura install won't take long - this will be the only way to get a feeling for what is going on

as i said in the initial post i had this verified on two systems on two different net connections - i'm sure you can replicate it

also if you look at what installs for SG in the Desura common folder you will find the distro files different as i outlined in the initial post

regards


Pardner wrote:I appologize for chopping up your post, I hope I did not take anything out of context. First MonsterBrowser
panzino wrote:Yes the monster browser pointing to Desura can be edited but not by many.

Why can't people edit the mod.ini? Yes, idealy people shouldn't have to modify anything.
panzino wrote:Putting a modified monster browser with the correct mods.ini file in the Desura distro might be a good idea...

panzino wrote:Perhaps just upload an all new set to Desura with a properly configured MonsterBrowser for noobs and let it update as Desura offers an update service.

MonsterBrowser is not package with Smokin' Guns and it is maintained separately. torhu is the one who created MB and its up to him to determin whether is packaged with Desura or not. (I will PM him, maybe if we are lucky he can fix MB to detect the Desura installed SG)

panzino wrote:...ideally this would be a non-issue since any server would point your program to file depository and you'd simply download the new files HOWEVER this does not work correctly because for SOME reason when you are running the game through Desura and it tries to dl the new files it goes EXTREMELY SLOWLY (would take days at that rate to DL the new files).

panzino wrote:Have no idea why it dl so slowly vs the direct install of SG but it does.

SG1.0 does not support html auto downloads. It uses Q3's way of downloading the content on the game connection (sorry network admins, I don't know the terminology and I'm being lazy and look it up). SG1.1 does support HTML downloads thanks to Tequila insegrating the IoQ3 patch. So.... basically... we wouldn't have to worry about this problem is Desora had SG1.1 avaliable for download!

panzino wrote:but you still need the updated supporting file structures to get them working out of box

This is the main problem. I am still confused. It looks like the Windows version was updated to SG1.1, but the Linux version was never updated. I am not sure what was uploaded for the linux release. Was it just the SG1.0 OS Independant package?
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Fri Jun 21, 2013 1:49 am

TheDoctor wrote:
Pardner wrote:SG1.0 does not support html auto downloads. It uses Q3's way of downloading the content on the game connection.
You're right. In SG1.0, the only way to transfer .PK3 files is for the server to append the data as payload to its game packets. As a consequence, this type of download is either slow or possibly disturbs the gameplay as it utilizes the server's connection.

Pardner wrote:I am not sure what was uploaded for the linux release. Was it just the SG1.0 OS Independant package?
I don't know Desura and at the moment, I cannot answer the question. Could we PM sparcdr and ask him, if he could explain to us what needs to be done to package SG1.1 for Desura on Linux?



Whatever is on Desura is not the distro that is being downloaded from the SG site directly. I outlined specific files in my initial post and sizes - I suggest everyone please go look at the information and replicate what i'm saying so you won't be stabbing in the dark trying to figure it out and wasting your precious time. The Desura SG distro is very different with different files and while I haven't done a checksum on any of the files I am beginning to think maybe the actual exe might be different after looking at your posts on the dl methods.

An upload of the files that are on the SG site to desura and telling desura to update existing users MIGHT fix the DL problem unless its related to the file structure or something - this I can't really speculate too much on.


Thanks for looking into things. Best regards to all :)
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby Pardner » Fri Jun 21, 2013 2:25 pm

The windows package looks like SG1.1
desura_win.png

But the linux looks like SG1.0.
desura_linux.png


For anyone listed in the Smokin' Guns Dev team on Desura/Moddb, here is the link the the packages: http://www.desura.com/games/publish/smokin-guns/execute
It would be really really nice to get 1.2 pushed and we can clear all this up in a single release!

panzino: what version of SG do you have and what OS are you using? The SG version can be found by launching the game and pressing "~" to pull down the console. The SG version will be in the lower-right of the console.


panzino wrote:i suggest you install desura and install sg under it
then have a look at the slow dl bug i'm referring too
it simply does not work right

Just to be clear, its not a bug. It is old game technology (cc 1998). The new version of Smokin' Guns supports fast downloads.

panzino wrote:sg installed in the normal default folder does dl at normal speeds

This might be the new version of SG. Back in the Q3 days, it was faster to close the game, web search the map/mod, download, and install than it was to try and download it in-game!


panzino wrote:also if you look at what installs for SG in the Desura common folder you will find the distro files different as i outlined in the initial post

I will try to get to it this weekend. I make no promises.... wife and I just moved this week and my PC is still locked up in a storage locker! :evil: I'll try to sneak it onto her laptop!
torhu wrote:I'm not a Desura user, so if someone wants to post the needed changes to mods.ini, that would be nice. At least people can find them here then

There's no reason the builtin server browser shouldn't work properly though, is everyone using SG through Desura having the same issue?

I'll try to get Desura installed and give you the default install location for SG. I don't know if there is a way to find it like you do with SG's registry.
I think the problem is Desura has SG1.0, most servers are running SG1.1. I don't know if a 1.0 client will find 1.1 servers. (Will find out this weekend).
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Fri Jun 21, 2013 10:55 pm

hi Pardner

OK, good info on finding the version # in the game!! This will shed a lot of light on the subject. I knew the distro's were different but this confirms it - Desura IS a 1.1 but its 1.1b4 specifically

The SG direct download is 1.1_svn642

I guess 1.1b4 had the old DL method still

Yes I think any update to 1.2 and cover all bases would save a lot of trouble for all.

If there is anything I can do to assist let me know,

Regards
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby Pardner » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:13 pm

Ahhhh that explains quite a bit. I will upload (when I get a chance) the new 1.1 release for windows. I hope if I upload the 1. OS independent package as the Linux release, it will satisfy the Linux Desura users.
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Re: DESURA distribution is OLD - it needs to be replaced

Postby panzino » Wed Jul 03, 2013 3:55 am

Pardner et al,

Lannukka.fi's admin updated to 1.1 he's all clear - loads fine now not trying to dl the old files


did you get a chance to update desura? if so i'll go and reinstall through there and make sure all is well.....

regards
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