Should the building be opened or closed?

[Pardner]

It is always a little scary modification a popular map, especially one like Durango. I wanted to post pictures in order to get some feedback.

I have opened up the top portion of the building by the robber spawn. This looks really cool in game and adds to the robber advantage. A robber can camp in the building and shoot defenders as they come to the stairs or through the lower part of the building. I tried to make it so there wasn't good cover in the top of the building. Just remember, in order for a robber to win, he must rob the bank or kill the other team.

Pics:




Questions, comments, discussions welcome. I may post the compiled package up on Moddb for testing if need be.

~Pard

[SmokeyBacon]

This is a nice looking modification but that building and the spawn area are already regularly camped. If that area is to be added then I would suggest making a way for people to get up to the low tiled roof next to the upper windows from the terrace side of the map. Maybe a pile of crates next to the wooden wall. That way defenders can have a chance to sneak up on campers upstairs.

In addition, this would allow defenders to stand on the top crate and shoot at campers in the spawn with the lower half of his body in cover thanks to the wall.

I feel this would be a well balanced solution.

[thumb=http://forum.smokin-guns.org/userpix/3451_drango_1.jpg][timg]3451_drango_1.jpg[/timg][/thumb]

[Pardner]

[thumb=http://forum.smokin-guns.org/userpix/3451_drango_1.jpg][timg]3451_drango_1.jpg[/timg][/thumb]

Or possibly a ladder. I feel the creates would be in the way of the stairs on the other side.... but creates would provide for more cover in a gun fight.

[SmokeyBacon]

Myabe I drew those crates too far to the right. But yes, a ladder would serve the same two purposes just as well and wouldn't interfere with the palm tree courtyard as much. Plus people camping on the ladder would be exposed to people flanking them from behind because they cant turn round!

[Pardner]

For reference, here is an image of behind the fence:

[Juaro Juarez]

I guess this would give a good Modification. Cause at the moment, how Durango is, robbers just got three choices( two of them are really rare, that the succed)
1.Running straight and fast in that tunnel before any robbers can come with sawed offs or dynas( but this one often fails cause of guys campng in the tunnel or in front of it at this house)
2.Running left( which often has no success because of guys staying on that balcony where you can go to from the clothesline or just camping in that house where you have to go to when you want to come to small bank.)
3. CAMP, oh hell yeah and camp( that is most of the time the most accurate way to get succes, so that next round the other team are the Losers which have to rob.)

EDIT:There is also a modificated way of 2. which brings sometimes succes(more often then just normal 2. and 1.)
That would be if you go left and then go to that fontaine and then straight to Main Bank or small bank ( main gets often diturbed by guys camping on that top of the tunnel thingie or on the spawn barn)[Small Bank is okay, but most of the time when you do that you're the only one left and its also hard then.

-JUAR-OW!

[dowoshek]

(Additionally to the ladder/crates) there could be easy access from stairs to the widened shelf:
[thumb=http://forum.smokin-guns.org/userpix/3476_shot0014hn_1.jpg][timg]3476_shot0014hn_1.jpg[/timg][/thumb]

But TBH I'm not so sure if creating camp places for robbers is a good idea at all (even if there's 1 point after timeout for defenders in 1.1). With this kind of encouragement to camping many/most of >>robberies<< will become a camp festival. Rounds will last even longer with more and more minutes of waiting for not camping players. At the beginning of round robbers will wait some time to check if the opponents are stupid enough to rush their camp-base.

The best way to test if these'd be good modifications is to leave both versions of Durango still available for admins and players.

[mLy!]

Sorry Pardner, but this is a horrible idea. It only encourages more camping in spawn and this definatly cannot be the idea of a robbers team?

Apart from the fact that Durango does not need modification, this kind of idea should not be implemented in ANY map.

[Juaro Juarez]

Maaybee.. add some barns or walls or boxes ...
For example at that palm tree area some boxes
Or some more options to kill that guy sitting at the stairs in the house on the way to the small bank.

Got some examples here:

First some Boxes like on Farm on that free field between both banks:


Then That campers i mean where maybe some more options are needed:



And then some really hard but maybe good idea:
Addind a wall here might get the robbers some more advantage and defenders less ways to come to robber spawn, but they still got three ways left then :

[Pardner]

I have only fixed the known bugs in Durango. This is what you will see in 1.1b5 or any up coming release. I have no intention of forcing a change on Durango, and making drastic changes is not my intention.

This mod come out so nicely, but I saw that it did effect gameplay.... which is why it was posted here. It would be nice if we could organize a test day for this just to see how much of an advantage it give. Being that Durango is one of the most popular maps, these changes would only happen if it completely felt right.

I thought about increasing the size of that ledge, but defenders would be easy targets to camping robbers in the top of the building.
Additionally I could open the upper wall of the building here:

[Sucalakafufu]

I think that this modification looks cool and may play alright. I disagree with Juaro in the area of robbing. There are many things you can do to rob in Durango. I half agree with mLy in that this may make more campers instead of robbers. However, I do feel it could be fun and maybe give the map more excitement IF ways to kill the campers are implemented.

Pardner: A test day would probably be the best way to figure out how much of an advantage it gives robbers AND/OR if it makes people feel like camping every time. The ladder that you and Smokey have suggested seems like the best balancing option as of right now.

[Twig]

Seeing as there is already quite a bit of camping at the robber spawn i don't see why it should be made any more attractive. Durango is a pretty well balanced map imo and if changes were made i feel like they should encourage robbers to move out and rob, not wait and see if the defenders are'nt patient. I just don't think it's a good idea.

[Black Jack Ketchum]

I don't now about the idea of changing one of the most played and favored map of SmokinGuns, but i don't want to set my mind before its tested. But fact is it would give a new dimension to the map, if the upstairs gets opened up, i think a ladder at the wall (as mentioned) would be necessary.

moRtem, which Sg BR map is your favorite then?

[Pardner]

Split topic, if you are looking to argue about camping, please see this thread. On topic please.

Let me get through the next couple weeks of school. I hope I can put some finishing touches on the modification. I will package it and put it up for testing. this does not mean it will be incorporated into1.1.